Archive for Over the Gate Join in for a friendly chat over the gate about home and country matters. (Nominated Charity The British Heart Foundation)
 


       Over the Gate Forum Index -> Pest Control
chicken feed

Its all change from 2016

Rat poison purchase's are you all aware of the changes coming into force from 2016 ?? you will no longer be able to buy bait in sizes over 1.5kg unless you have completed a course and carry there certification to back it up. Which will leave you paying way over the odds for small amounts or paying someone to come in a do your rodent control.

You can either go on a one day course or there are some online courses. Did mine last month so I am good to go ….I must say if you have been doing it properly over the years it is not a problem to pass I passed with flying colours.
bodger

I've got an RSH certificate with distinction, I recieved it from the then Salford Poly. It was along time ago and and its since been eaten by mice in the loft, where it was being kept for safe keeping. It maybe worth my while seeing if I can get a replacement. As I recall, it was a six day course spread out over a few weeks.
chicken feed

bodger wrote:
I've got an RSH certificate with distinction, I recieved it from the then Salford Poly. It was along time ago and the mice and its since been eaten by mice in the loft, where it was being kept for safe keeping. It maybe worth my while seeing if I can get a replacement. As I recall, it was a six day course spread out over a few weeks.


You will need proof of compliancy before you can purchase so could be worth asking … buying those 1.5kg is expensive.
12Bore

Bodger, has your certificate been ratified?    
bodger

Well and truly  
confused

Thanks for the update ,, I have been trapping them , I had 11 in the trap at one time !!!!  25 in 2 days . scary stuff.
bodger

You've got a lot of rats mate.
The Rat

The sooner they ban the sale of rodenticedes to the general public the better,
all the new regulations are coming in because of misuse which has caused a lot of secondary poisoning of non target species.
I work as a full time pest controller and i am often called in after someone has tried to do there own pest control with poison placed in some of the most stupid places, with no thought to wildlife, livestock and pets,  some jobs i go to i take one look and refuse to get involved as i dont want anyone thinking i have had anything to do with what has been going on.

Brian
bodger

Better to be safe than sorry.
A lot of it is common sense but then some people are devoid of that commodity.
HonkHonk

Re: Its all change from 2016

chicken feed wrote:
Rat poison purchase's are you all aware of the changes coming into force from 2016 ?? you will no longer be able to buy bait in sizes over 1.5kg unless you have completed a course and carry there certification to back it up. Which will leave you paying way over the odds for small amounts or paying someone to come in a do your rodent control.

You can either go on a one day course or there are some online courses. Did mine last month so I am good to go ….I must say if you have been doing it properly over the years it is not a problem to pass I passed with flying colours.


It seems as though people are already paying for over the odds even when you get a pest controller in.

Recently in work we had a large, well known company attend site as they do periodically, when a colleague  made some comment about using the good stuff to sort the buggers out, the pest control officer replied that "we never use the good stuff because that way we would kill all the rats and then have no reason to come back and charge them again, we use a weaker one that sorts out the weaker rats"
I am having a more than usual problem at the moment with all the surrounding ditches and streams flooded, can't seem to get on top of them, reckon I need a terrier adding to the family.  
confused

Re: Its all change from 2016

It seems as though people are already paying for over the odds even when you get a pest controller in.

Recently in work we had a large, well known company attend site as they do periodically, when a colleague  made some comment about using the good stuff to sort the buggers out, the pest control officer replied that "we never use the good stuff because that way we would kill all the rats and then have no reason to come back and charge them again, we use a weaker one that sorts out the weaker rats"
I am having a more than usual problem at the moment with all the surrounding ditches and streams flooded, can't seem to get on top of them, reckon I need a terrier adding to the family.  [/qcuote]

I can only agree, I have killed rats for most of my life , but the rats I am encountering at the moment are some of the most resilient ------ I have ever come across , At the moment I would say that the amount of rats around our allotments is as bad I have ever seen in all my life .
welshboy

12Bore wrote:
Bodger, has your certificate been ratified?    

Very clever  
HonkHonk

I have just spoken to a guy about this new legislation thingy, and his reply was.......... mouse poison!

I questioned weather or not that would kill a rat.

He says he was once told by a poisons retailer/distributor that because a rat will eat and eat it gets a lot of the poison inside of it so they don't have to spend a lot of cash on the poison part of it, but a mouse only eats a few grains then it is full, so the mouse poison is made to a much stronger dose, and apparently wipes rats out.

Another I got told of, a home made idea   get a tin of mackerel empty out the oil or whatever and replace that with antifreeze!   not sure about that one tbh.
eddie b

HonkHonk wrote:
Another I got told of, a home made idea   get a tin of mackerel empty out the oil or whatever and replace that with antifreeze!   not sure about that one tbh.


That might be a little bit inhumane I recon!
Yorkshire Geordie

eddie b wrote:
HonkHonk wrote:
Another I got told of, a home made idea   get a tin of mackerel empty out the oil or whatever and replace that with antifreeze!   not sure about that one tbh.


That might be a little bit inhumane I recon!


But a rat is not human - it will, however, depend on your conscience.  

Martyn
eddie b

Yorkshire Geordie wrote:
eddie b wrote:
HonkHonk wrote:
Another I got told of, a home made idea   get a tin of mackerel empty out the oil or whatever and replace that with antifreeze!   not sure about that one tbh.


That might be a little bit inhumane I recon!


But a rat is not human - it will, however, depend on your conscience.  

Martyn


I wish it was as simple as that! But in this day and age, we have to be very careful in how we deal with anything associated with animals, even rat's!
HonkHonk

Well I asked a pest control guy about the antifreeze and he said yep that'll work just the same as any poison we use, so I had a go with the fish but they didn't take it, preferring next door's windfall apples,  I then noticed some evidence of them being under my wood store,  so a few dog biscuits soaked in the stuff and eventually it went, and no fresh holes dug for 2 days now  
matt the rat

First time on here for yonks, and yonks and yonks, and I've been stirred into posting almost straight away!

Yes, anti freeze will kill just about anything.  Rats, mice, cats, dogs, chickens, sheep, cattle, horses and even people.

We have a system of 'approval' in this country.  If you want to use a 'poison' of any sort, it has to be tested and proven to be safe and effective.  When it's approved, instructions for it's safe use are printed out on the label in the hope that people will use the product without causing mayhem.

Using anti freeze for anything except it's intended purpose (stopping coolant from freezing) is a CRIMINAL OFFENCE.

Why?

Well, it's to stop really stupid people from killing indiscriminately and to help keep people, children, pets and livestock SAFE.

Now the 'system' we use may be some way of being perfect, and people who say they are 'professional pest controllers' may not actually be brilliant at killing pests, but *please* do not risk using anti freeze for anything except your engine coolant........


Nice to be back btw,

Matt
bodger

Yes! Using antifreeze is very much illegal and I'm ashamed to say that the earlier posts on this thread slipped past me. Thanks Matt.
HonkHonk

Well as it goes I suppose  it was a bit of an experiment for me partly out of frustration as I was sick of the sight of rats, also it actually went against what I morally believe as I hate the thought of secondary poisoning in non target species. (that is why I'm looking for a terrier to do the job)

Also I think a bit of personnel good housekeeping is a must, when I managed to get a free few hours last week I tidied up a bit in an outdoor store I have, found a few half eaten apples and a rat corpse, I have caught one in a live trap but mostly they seem to stay away from that. They are back but I can't see where they are living, I have spoken to the people next door about cleaning up the apples and they are warming to the idea that I shall cut down their tree for free as long as I can have the logs generated  

I probably won't use the antifreeze again because of the secondary poisoning point, hmmm now then! I wonder if paracetamol is safer to use    
bodger

Threaten them with you getting a pig HH and offering to feed the apples to it. What's the betting that the apples soon get picked up?
HonkHonk

Haha, unfortunately they know we aren't allowed livestock at the properties, same landlord  
matt the rat

Primary poisoning is more of an issue with Anti Freeze than secondary....

Anyway, you are quite right; most infestations can be cleared up with some modifications to habitat.  The fast majority of problems I've seen in the last 30 years are actually caused by poor housekeeping and hygiene.  Killing rats is easy; getting rid of infestation issues takes more effort than a bit of bait.

Local Authorities have a legal duty to identify rat problems and can, if necessary carry out works and charge for them.  If your neighbour is feeding and harbouring rats that are infesting other properties, then they should get involved.

The most common causes of rat infestations in homes from my experience are:

Bird Feeding:  People love to feed birds, but more often than not actually over feed them.  Put something under your feeders to catch the spillage, and more the feeders around a bit.  Rats hate a changing environment.

Backyard Poultry  There used to be an old saying: "you want foxes, get some geese. You want rats, get some ducks".  Keep moving your poultry around, don't overfeed them or leave food out overnight, and remove their drinking water every night.  Rats need to drink lots of water, and you'd be amazed how much of a drawer it can be to have fountain drinkers etc permanently placed in gardens.  Get some break back type traps and place them (in tunnels) around your garden to pick up passing rats before they establish themselves.
DO NOT keep bait down all the time.  It's now illegal to do so, and causes massive problems long term.  Bait is a useful tool to use to kill off existing infestations providing you follow the instructions.

Rubbish & Junk  That pile of old pallets you've been saving up, or the stack of old pipes, or whatever it happens to be, is providing an ideal hidy hole for our long tailed friends.  Clear it up, use it, recycle it, or even get rid of it.  

Drainage Faults It's amazing how often I've seen householders with rats living in the loft.  They call in 'pest control' who put some bait down in the loft which kills the rats.  A week or two later there is a bad smell, and the pest controller comes back, quotes to replace the fibreglass and spray the loft with disinfectant and all is well again for a few months.
Then it all starts again, and they cycle of baiting, spraying, etc continues while the pest control company make good money.  What is often happening is that rats are entering the loft from the sewer system, via the wall cavity and finding lots of lovely food waiting for them in lofts.  I've seen this scenario many, many times, and had customers ask me why I'm looking in the manholes when the problem is in the loft....

Anyway, I'm just trying to offer some basic advice here with no strings attached.  I'm no longer in the pest control business, but still keep an interest in it.

After nearly 30 years of pest control I now drive a van and earn peanuts.  Without a doubt one of the best life decisions I've ever made.[/b]
bodger

You've got to be happy in life, you only get the one go at it.
HonkHonk

Cheers Matt.

Ok we live down a single track lane with fields front and back and a large private estate at the end of the road.
There are 5 houses in our lane. We are at No2
No1 (attached to us) has just recently decided to stop feeding wild birds after doing so for 20 odd years. Very tidy garden
No2 us, we have a large garden pond, so plenty of water there for them. 2 sheds on breezeblocks one is for the dogs with lots of straw in there.
No3 The apple tree owners, never collect the windfall, have rubbish stacked up behind a 6x4 shed that was previously used as a pigeon loft.
No4 No probs there, no animals, no feeding, keep the place tidy.
End place is an old Gate Lodge. Free range hens, not kept in the cleanest of ways just throws scraps and food onto the floor no feed dishes, lives a rather old fashioned scruffy style. Although he claims to regularly poison the rats doesn't seem as concerned as I am about them being around.
Toddy

Help please ?

I'm pretty sure I have rats taken up residence recently in one of my compost bins. These bins are the plastic Dalek shaped ones the Council supply to folks who want them.

I compost everything, from teabags to vegetable peelings, the garden litter (and we shred bigger prunings) grass cuttings and the used soil from plant pots. Our soil is heavy Lanarkshire blue clay, it devours organic matter, but it's very fertile. I need my compost bins.
My gardens are a wildlife haven too, we have newts in both ponds, and there's a burn runs past the side fence beside tree lined paths,

I want rid of the rats. I know I'll not be able to ever be totally rat free in environment living where we do, but I don't want to encourage the blighters, iimmc. I do feed the birds, but I'm careful with it, and stored food is kept in huge jars and metal boxes to prevent rodents getting to it.

The only place I seem to 'have' rats is in the one compost bin (there are three)

It's a closed bin, so I'm not too concerned about anything else being inadvertantly harmed by poison, I'll keep that one closed and not let the robins peck over it.

What do I use to kill these rats please ?

Last time we had a rat trying to nest under a shed (about fifteen years ago) my brother shot it with an air gun. We don't have airguns now though, and I haven't actually seen these ones, just some very suspicious tunnels in the compost bin.

M
matt the rat

HonkHonk wrote:
Cheers Matt.

Ok we live down a single track lane with fields front and back and a large private estate at the end of the road.
There are 5 houses in our lane. We are at No2
No1 (attached to us) has just recently decided to stop feeding wild birds after doing so for 20 odd years. Very tidy garden
No2 us, we have a large garden pond, so plenty of water there for them. 2 sheds on breezeblocks one is for the dogs with lots of straw in there.
No3 The apple tree owners, never collect the windfall, have rubbish stacked up behind a 6x4 shed that was previously used as a pigeon loft.
No4 No probs there, no animals, no feeding, keep the place tidy.
End place is an old Gate Lodge. Free range hens, not kept in the cleanest of ways just throws scraps and food onto the floor no feed dishes, lives a rather old fashioned scruffy style. Although he claims to regularly poison the rats doesn't seem as concerned as I am about them being around.


Have you asked if you can pick up the windfalls?  It seems a terrible waste to me, and if they'd let you it would remove the food source.

The rubbish that's piled up needs sorting out; obviously.  These things are always easier to broach when you have friendly relations.

As a last resort, you could contact your local EH dept and ask them to investigate and take action.  They can issue a 'Statutory Nuisance Notice'.  It may also be worth having a quiet word with the landlord.

Personally, I've always found that direct and personal contact with neighbours is preferable to reporting them here there and everywhere, but some people are just awkward.
matt the rat

Toddy wrote:
Help please ?

I'm pretty sure I have rats taken up residence recently in one of my compost bins. These bins are the plastic Dalek shaped ones the Council supply to folks who want them.

I compost everything, from teabags to vegetable peelings, the garden litter (and we shred bigger prunings) grass cuttings and the used soil from plant pots. Our soil is heavy Lanarkshire blue clay, it devours organic matter, but it's very fertile. I need my compost bins.
My gardens are a wildlife haven too, we have newts in both ponds, and there's a burn runs past the side fence beside tree lined paths,

I want rid of the rats. I know I'll not be able to ever be totally rat free in environment living where we do, but I don't want to encourage the blighters, iimmc. I do feed the birds, but I'm careful with it, and stored food is kept in huge jars and metal boxes to prevent rodents getting to it.

The only place I seem to 'have' rats is in the one compost bin (there are three)

It's a closed bin, so I'm not too concerned about anything else being inadvertantly harmed by poison, I'll keep that one closed and not let the robins peck over it.

What do I use to kill these rats please ?

Last time we had a rat trying to nest under a shed (about fifteen years ago) my brother shot it with an air gun. We don't have airguns now though, and I haven't actually seen these ones, just some very suspicious tunnels in the compost bin.

M


I've had this exact problem myself.

The plastic 'darlek' type compost bins are very good.  They contain the compost and heat up really well.

I put mine on four concrete slabs to stop them burrowing into the base and installed two or three break back type traps (the Kness ones) into tunnels around it made of bricks.

The problem with compost bins is that they provide everything rats are looking for: somewhere warm and safe from predators, with plenty of food scraps for good measure...

Don't stop composting; I'm a huge fan of making good use of waste; but do put the bin on something solid (four slabs are ideal because it still allows some drainage), and when you empty it out in the spring move it to a different location.

Rats are everywhere, and they're opportunists; a poultry shed or compost bin is just a honey pot for them.  Traps will pick up passing rats before they have a chance to get their feet under the table.
matt the rat

Sorry, to add to the last post, don't put bait down in the compost bin that has rats.  Empty it out and try and kill whatever is living there.  Sticks, alcathene pipe, dogs, whatever......

The vast majority of rodenticide bait put down by home owners gets eaten by mice (that go on to be eaten by BOP) rather than rats.

The wrong choice of active ingredient, the wrong choice of formulation and the wrong placement are the usual reasons for poor uptake of bait by rats.
HonkHonk

Thanks for that info, I too have two of those daleks, just emptied one and am thinking of relocating them, some good points there.
The apples are bakers we sometimes have a few but there are hundreds left to rot, I'm quite liking the idea of getting my chainsaw out tbh    i'll offer a bit of advice when I do get around there.  
matt the rat

HonkHonk wrote:
Thanks for that info, I too have two of those daleks, just emptied one and am thinking of relocating them, some good points there.
The apples are bakers we sometimes have a few but there are hundreds left to rot, I'm quite liking the idea of getting my chainsaw out tbh    i'll offer a bit of advice when I do get around there.  


Make some cider, or worst case scenario, compost them...
Toddy

Thank you Matt

The bins are set under the trees at the high fence. The ground is very bumpy with their roots, but I'll see what I can do about getting some slabs under them when I empty them.

I think in the meantime I'll just start emptying them shovelful by shovelful from the bottom access flap thingie, and hope that the disturbance might discourage contented rodent residence.

Not so keen on traps; I have to admit that I'm not keen on emptying them at all  
Didn't mind the idea of poison so much 'cos I reckoned that the carcases could just rot down fine in the bin, and would become just so much compost themselves.
I think I need to pester Himself to consider them though.

M
HonkHonk

Well, two in two nights! First one Alfie the young lurcher made his first kill of a half grown rat, then the next night I had one fully grown female in a cage trap, that was a couple of days ago and there does not seem to be any more activity yet  

       Over the Gate Forum Index -> Pest Control
Page 1 of 1
Create your own free forum | Buy a domain to use with your forum